wildchild
Heat Winner
That's What She Said
Posts: 185
|
Post by wildchild on Oct 4, 2013 7:08:56 GMT -5
I love Slant 6's, as long as she has a LITTLE bit of oil and water your golden. I drove a 75 Swinger 40 miles a day for a week with next to no oil presure when I was a teen, she was getting a little clicketie clackie and I just thought the lifters were getting bad because it always was little louder then normal. And when the bottom end started squealing I knew something was WRONG. Turns out the oil pump puked and the oil light in the dash was burnt out. Oh well live and learn(stupid kid)lol. A few questions for you Johnny L, are you using a steel forged crank, I'm pretty sure 69 block should have one (geat for RMPs)? Have you thought of using a 4bbl? I realize you don't want to invest too much money into a derby motor but if you can find a used Offenhauser aluminum intake that may be an opption. Are you able to run a distributor protector (because of the location so close to the inner of a Dodge anyway)? I hope you have good luck with your experiment and please keep us posted.
|
|
dm440c
Feature Winner
derby drivers against drama- there's no crying in demo derby!
Posts: 2,824
|
Post by dm440c on Oct 4, 2013 12:15:55 GMT -5
a note about lifters- these have solid lifters so be sure you adjust the lash.
Timing chains have the same plastic gear issue as the v8's so change it out.
On the question about the gears- personally I think the 5.13 gears are a little light and although that was with a 25" tire on small cars like Darts and Diplomats, I don't think I'd be happy with 4.56 on anything bigger than a roller skate wheel as I was actually considering going deeper into the 5's. Give it a try and see what you think, maybe the 4.56 will work for you.
Keep in mind the throttle cable linkage is very different so although your 318 carb will bolt on to the "Super Six" manifold you will need to fab up a new cable bracket. Not a big deal, but just know to expect that conflict when you dig in to it.
After considering the header issue I settled for just a single down pipe coming from the stock iron manifold for simplicity. It would be nice to send it up but with the proximity to the intake and the way the intake and exhaust share mounting bolts I wasn't up for the hassle... one nice thing is that the starter is up near the top of the bell housing so it is less affected by the heat from downward exhaust than a v8 typically is.
|
|
|
Post by XtremeMopar#307 on Oct 4, 2013 13:27:44 GMT -5
I was thinking about setting up another center section with 5.13 anyway... And for the cable I run one of them fancy floor mounted ones so the cable is no issue for me... Thanks... How are the ag ones, ? I've found several of those
|
|
dm440c
Feature Winner
derby drivers against drama- there's no crying in demo derby!
Posts: 2,824
|
Post by dm440c on Oct 5, 2013 8:23:14 GMT -5
what I mean is the carburetor itself is different. The Super Six does use the same basic Carter BBD as the 318 and the base bolt pattern is the same but the carb itself is different where the cable connects and the brackets are completely different. If you are using a floor mount cable then you're probably mentally prepared to fab a new bracket anyway so it's not a big deal, but just making a note for others reading this.... if you had anticipated (as I once did) that a 318 carb would take 5 minutes to put on, it will take more than that. It's easy fab work for the typical derby builder but the famous last words "it will bolt right on" once again do not apply.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 6, 2013 10:06:24 GMT -5
Yeah I purposely hunted down a 60-71 to start with for the fact that they have a forged crank and made the most power from the factory during those years (they were all equipped with forged cranks until 76), along with forged connecting rods. The thought of a 4bbl has crossed my mind but the intakes are pricey and the runners are quite a bit longer than a 2bbl which leaves it sticking out more from the block and would be easier to damage. Also I prefer the throttle response of a 2bbl and can make close to the same amount of power a 4bbl would create with the right combination of head work and cam selection. Even with just the 2bbl intake, carb, and 1.5" primary 3 into 1 header I've probably added close to 30 ft/lbs of torque which is a reasonable gain over stock. Now shave .050 off the head, 5 angle valve job, bigger valves, and a more aggressive cam and you're looking at a substantial increase in power without sacrificing reliability. The way to make real power from one of these is with a turbo. I've seen and read about 400 ft/lbs of torque at the wheels with a stock bottom end (just freshened up). Too bad it's not practical for the derby arena, but who know maybe someone would be nuts enough to try it... Planning on fabbing up a dist protector, carb protector and cradle this off-season. Will definitely post pics of the creative process once I get my hands on another block.
|
|
|
Post by White Trash #8 on Oct 6, 2013 12:24:12 GMT -5
Johnny-you runnin that slant in two weeks?
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 6, 2013 15:46:50 GMT -5
I dunno, I've been working 60+ hours a week lately and don't have time to take a dump let alone finish this thing up but it's still possible
|
|
|
Post by White Trash #8 on Oct 6, 2013 18:39:00 GMT -5
Only 60? welcome to my world, and thats not counting any side work.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 11, 2013 13:59:14 GMT -5
Well after some tuning and beating on, I've come to the realization that this head needs to be gone thru or replaced. I'm sure I have a bad exhaust valve on the #5 cylinder along with the valve stem seals being old and brittle and I might as well bite the bullet and make it right. I did a compression check/leakdown test and am sure the bottom end of the engine is in good shape. After doing alot of internet searching, I've found a re-man head with a mid 70's casting # (a bit better flowing combustion chamber design), 3 angle valve job, new valve seats, new valves and springs for $250 shipped with no core charge. I would be in for at least $100 more by taking my existing head into the machine shop and having it gone thru, like I said I'm trying to do this on the cheap. Since the head will be replaced, I might as well look at cam options as well. Comp offers a cam with a 264 duration and .440 lift with new lifters for $145 shipped, and that's cheaper than any cam re-grinders that I have found. I think it's time to change my number from 773 to 6=8 ; )
|
|
an171
Heat Winner
Posts: 443
|
Post by an171 on Oct 11, 2013 19:42:14 GMT -5
Get a little bit of $ in your pocket and u gotta spend it!
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 11, 2013 20:02:24 GMT -5
Ha! It's funny because it's true! Scratch the Comp cam idea, apparently they are prone to eating oil pump gears. That being said, I put in a call to Oregon Camshafts and they are going to get back to me with a max low end torque custom grind for my application...the best part is that a stock cam re-grind is only $70 plus the ride back and forth. Ebay has new lifters for $50 shipped so the total cost should be right around the same as a Comp setup.
|
|
dm440c
Feature Winner
derby drivers against drama- there's no crying in demo derby!
Posts: 2,824
|
Post by dm440c on Oct 14, 2013 10:51:58 GMT -5
just an opinion here... when it comes to engine parts like heads and blocks I'd much rather spend a little more to have work done at a local machine shop that I trust, where I can see and touch everything myself, than buy it off the internet where they did who-knows-what to it using who-knows-what kind of craftsmanship. Seen a whole lot of shoddy work done when they don't have to look you in the eye. Of course, if you don't have a local machine shop that you already have a good relationship with then it's much less of a risk.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 15, 2013 16:58:16 GMT -5
I do value your opinion Dan and appreciate your input. The place I'm getting the head from is a very reputable head re-manufacturer out of Oakland California that's been in business since the 60's and they have a good track record. I actually asked around at slantsix.org and some guys over there have used this company in the past with zero complaints. I got a call back from Oregon cams as well and they were very helpful with suggesting a cam for this engine's intended demo derby use. They suggest a 219/219 @ .050", 264/264 adv, .437"/.437" lift grind that will make the most torque and mid range power for the stock spec head, auto trans w/stock converter, and the 4.88 gear I'm using. $75 to regrind my cam and they have new lifters for $52. Looks like the engine is coming apart this weekend and I'll be ordering this stuff shortly after. I can't wait to turn a few heads with this setup...
|
|
|
Post by Dan-Ervine-383 on Oct 16, 2013 6:12:57 GMT -5
More videos of the finished product will be a must. . LOL
|
|
|
Post by Johnny L on Oct 18, 2013 7:48:19 GMT -5
Well this project is going on the back burner for a couple of months, I just spent all my fun money on a '68 Imperial sedan that I got a call about yesterday. Sometime after the new year this engine will get finished up (or even sooner when I sell the 440 out of the Imp) and yes, there will be mucho pics and videos to come.
|
|