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Post by klicky96 on Feb 13, 2016 11:44:34 GMT -5
You shouldn't drill holes. You don't want to drain the cooler. You want the water to stay in there. Ice=cold, ice+water=colder, ice+water+salt=coldest. But why drain the water? No, the water wouldn't "boil", that's why there's ice. If it's boiling, you're running way too long. Soooo.... I'm not trying to start a pissing match, but I've gotta hear the logic behind ice+water is colder than straight ice? I think what you're trying to say, is that the ice water has better cooling properties than straight ice, which is true, simply because of the surface area it touches.... (Odd shaped pieces of ice don't touch 100% of the cooler like water does.) As for the salt, I also don't believe the temperature is any "colder" than the others above, but by adding salt, you've done a few things, 1st you've kinda kick started the heat tranfer process, that temp difference has to go somewhere, so from the ice it goes into the water, which now (#2 thing) has a lower freezing point from adding the salt, sooooo.... in reality the water could be well below normal freezing point (32°F/0°C), and not freeze. 3rd thing that this leads to, is the ice not melting as fast. And I know, you added salt, it's gonna melt right? Yes, but not as fast not regular unsalinated (salted) water, since the water around it is now below the freezing point. It's all about energy (temperature) change. This is how my tiny brain process this info anyway. Anybody feel free to correct, illiterate, or add onto what I said. I see no bad info here. You worded it good and easy to understand. And I'm not saying add salt, it was a thought though. But, what I am saying is, while agreeing with you, without the water, the ice won't be as effective. Also, I don't see your post as arguing. I see it is information good for the topic.
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Post by redneckracing12 on Feb 13, 2016 12:13:08 GMT -5
My biggest issue with the salt is the rust and corrosion. Steel box and fittings with aluminum coolers and aluminum an fittings. I hate to throw salt in with all the different materials.
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Post by rt1979 on Feb 14, 2016 0:40:29 GMT -5
My biggest issue with the salt is the rust and corrosion. Steel box and fittings with aluminum coolers and aluminum an fittings. I hate to throw salt in with all the different materials. I think I'm with you on this one.
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Post by Luke Wells on Feb 14, 2016 9:34:17 GMT -5
I'm not saying to add salt, I just wanted to kinda explain how it works.
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Post by 383 Sonoma on Feb 14, 2016 10:23:39 GMT -5
Had a buddy put a bunch salt in the Barrell with a keg once. It froze the beer
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Post by klicky96 on Feb 14, 2016 17:00:04 GMT -5
I'm not saying to add salt, I just wanted to kinda explain how it works. Exactly what I was getting at. Would I put salt in mine? No, but I just went on a little scientific rant I guess lol
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Post by amkear613 on Feb 14, 2016 21:48:40 GMT -5
Salt decreases the freezing point of water. I agree with you guys on the corrosion factor. If you want to do a home experiment take two cups of ice water and add a teaspoon of salt to one and have two thermometers handy. Stir up both. Your ice water will be freezing cold. But your ice and salt and water will be colder. In highschool i did this in physics and if i remember correctly i got the salt and ice mixture to about 14 degrees verses 30 plus.
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Post by STROMI 121 on Feb 14, 2016 22:44:49 GMT -5
The temperature of the ice and water before the derby is irrelevant. Test to see which one stays cool the longest with hot fluid running through the coils. That's the only thing that is relevant. Were not making ice cream.
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Post by kraftsman on Feb 19, 2016 8:48:11 GMT -5
This what I usually run, I even put my fuel line through it. Drive it like you stole it!!
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Post by scottgropp on Feb 19, 2016 14:44:48 GMT -5
If you use plain copper tube as a trans cooler, most of the discussion of the other important parts of the trans cooling system are irrelevant because copper tube doesn't transfer much heat out anyway. If you cut a corner on the actual item that exchanges the fluid heat, why bother worrying about the rest?
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Post by kraftsman on Feb 19, 2016 14:50:43 GMT -5
I filled it to the top with ice and the lines never got hot. I agree with you on the heat dissipation part but it works. Is it the best, probably not but it was all stuff laying around.
Drive it like you stole it!!
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Post by amkear613 on Feb 20, 2016 19:37:11 GMT -5
If you use plain copper tube as a trans cooler, most of the discussion of the other important parts of the trans cooling system are irrelevant because copper tube doesn't transfer much heat out anyway. If you cut a corner on the actual item that exchanges the fluid heat, why bother worrying about the rest? As a serious question: what would you recommend? I plan on making/purchasing two or three trans coolers. I like the homemade copper line coolers because they are simple. But i'm considering purchasing the tube type cooler and putting in ice bath. I like the idea of not having another electrical item to possibly fail on me in the future
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Post by scottgropp on Feb 21, 2016 9:11:15 GMT -5
I filled it to the top with ice and the lines never got hot. I agree with you on the heat dissipation part but it works. Is it the best, probably not but it was all stuff laying around. Drive it like you stole it!! If neither line got hot then the cooler wasn't needed anyway. One line, the inlet to the cooler from the trans, should be warmer then the outlet line from the cooler back to the trans. I experimented with coolers and temp drops in the late 90's. For a 5 minute heat or feature who cares. But with a trans that you are working hard, you need to see a drop in the line temp for it to be doing any good. Here is a brief description from my website from December 2003: web.archive.org/web/20031203065816/http://www.groppautomotive.com/Parts/Transmissions.htmlink
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Post by radrider on Feb 21, 2016 10:27:45 GMT -5
This what I usually run, I even put my fuel line through it. Drive it like you stole it!! Hello; In the past I ran a cooler very similar to this one. I didn't have quite as much tubing in mine. I would pack it full of ice before each run. Heat Consi. Feature whatever. I noticed that after a 7 minute heat all the ice would be melted. So I just had the warm water left to cool the lines. I also see folks put an air cooled trans cooler in an ice cooler. The same happens. An air cooler needs air to circulate through the fins, not warm water to soak in. Radrider
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Post by scottgropp on Feb 21, 2016 11:33:56 GMT -5
Fill a glass full of ice, let it melt, see how much water is left. Fill a glass with ice water, let it melt. See how much is left.
Ice has too much air between it. In my 20 gallon coolers I used with real heat exchangers, I used water only. Cool water with that much water volume rarely caused a cooling issue. I had people who bought them and used to panic that they were almost too hot to touch after a 1 or longer feature. I asked if they ever checked the water temp. They had not, because few people purchased the expensive IR thermal gun like I did (15 years ago they were pretty pricey, unlike today). If you ever had a hot tub, you know that 110 degrees F is really hot for the body to handle. So a trans cooler with water temp at 140 is really too hot to touch. But most trans coolers at the factory go through the radiator, and run between 190-210 for most of their lives. So 140 isn't anything. Common sense, but it rarely seems it is common in the derby parts business.
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